Hi All,

Here's a question for all the FAR/AIM experts:

Each year our childrens' school has a charity auction to raise money
for various events, services, and equipment. My wife had the idea that
I could donate a one hour flight, which could be auctioned for the
benefit of the school.

I'm thinking that I'm OK here, but wonder what the collective wisdom
may have to say. My rationale is this: I will receive in no way,
shape, or form any compensation for my flying, from anyone.
Essentially, I'm donating my expenses (rental, etc.) to the school and
I expect nothing in return. In reality, I'd go flying anyway on a nice
Saturday in April whether or not someone is tagging along with me. I
often take friends and acquaintances with me and again, I don't expect
or deamand any compensation from them. Is this any different?

Thanks for your input!

-CAE-

Charity flights are now considered to "charter under Part
135" unless there is an exemption. You will need to contact
your local FSDO and discuss the event well in advance. They
will tell you what steps need to be taken and whether drug
testing can be waived. You will need to meet pilot
qualifications, of course be fully current and you should
speak to your insurance company. The school will also
probably be requiring that your have a rider on your
insurance to cover the school, speak to the school and your
insurance agent.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"CAE" > wrote in message
oups.com...
| Hi All,
|
| Here's a question for all the FAR/AIM experts:
|
| Each year our childrens' school has a charity auction to
raise money
| for various events, services, and equipment. My wife had
the idea that
| I could donate a one hour flight, which could be auctioned
for the
| benefit of the school.
|
| I'm thinking that I'm OK here, but wonder what the
collective wisdom
| may have to say. My rationale is this: I will receive in
no way,
| shape, or form any compensation for my flying, from
anyone.
| Essentially, I'm donating my expenses (rental, etc.) to
the school and
| I expect nothing in return. In reality, I'd go flying
anyway on a nice
| Saturday in April whether or not someone is tagging along
with me. I
| often take friends and acquaintances with me and again, I
don't expect
| or deamand any compensation from them. Is this any
different?
|
| Thanks for your input!
|
| -CAE-
|

I discussed this with my CFI. He owns the school and sells 'intro flights'.
He is more than willing to donate a certificate good for one intro flight to
almost anyone.

He doesn't make much if any money on these flights, and uses them to bring
in new students.

Check with your flight school. Maybe they'll do the same thing.


"CAE" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Hi All,
>
> Here's a question for all the FAR/AIM experts:
>
> Each year our childrens' school has a charity auction to raise money
> for various events, services, and equipment. My wife had the idea that
> I could donate a one hour flight, which could be auctioned for the
> benefit of the school.
>
> I'm thinking that I'm OK here, but wonder what the collective wisdom
> may have to say. My rationale is this: I will receive in no way,
> shape, or form any compensation for my flying, from anyone.
> Essentially, I'm donating my expenses (rental, etc.) to the school and
> I expect nothing in return. In reality, I'd go flying anyway on a nice
> Saturday in April whether or not someone is tagging along with me. I
> often take friends and acquaintances with me and again, I don't expect
> or deamand any compensation from them. Is this any different?
>
> Thanks for your input!
>
> -CAE-
>

Note the part about the school being "a charitable organization identified
as such by the U. S. Department of the Treasury." This will probably come up
when you check with the FSDO.

Bob Gardner

"CAE" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Hi All,
>
> Here's a question for all the FAR/AIM experts:
>
> Each year our childrens' school has a charity auction to raise money
> for various events, services, and equipment. My wife had the idea that
> I could donate a one hour flight, which could be auctioned for the
> benefit of the school.
>
> I'm thinking that I'm OK here, but wonder what the collective wisdom
> may have to say. My rationale is this: I will receive in no way,
> shape, or form any compensation for my flying, from anyone.
> Essentially, I'm donating my expenses (rental, etc.) to the school and
> I expect nothing in return. In reality, I'd go flying anyway on a nice
> Saturday in April whether or not someone is tagging along with me. I
> often take friends and acquaintances with me and again, I don't expect
> or deamand any compensation from them. Is this any different?
>
> Thanks for your input!
>
> -CAE-
>

I've done this. Since the they are paying for the ride there are some
things you must do. You need to do two things...
1) If you are a private pilot you need notify the FSDO of your
intentions and send them the information the FARs require (log book
showing minimum time, currency, etc) See 61.113(d) for required items
to supply the FSDO.
2) Go to the AOPA website and submit an application for a drug test
exemption.
3) You will need to sure that you do not have more than 100 hours since
annual on the plane (otherwise you'll need a 100hr inspection).

You will need to have the non-profit 503c number of the charity as
well. All this is much easier if you are commercial because you can
skip step1.

Cheers
-Robert

> Here's a question for all the FAR/AIM experts:
>
> Each year our childrens' school has a charity auction to raise money
> for various events, services, and equipment. My wife had the idea that
> I could donate a one hour flight, which could be auctioned for the
> benefit of the school.
>
> I'm thinking that I'm OK here, but wonder what the collective wisdom
> may have to say. My rationale is this: I will receive in no way,
> shape, or form any compensation for my flying, from anyone.
> Essentially, I'm donating my expenses (rental, etc.) to the school and
> I expect nothing in return. In reality, I'd go flying anyway on a nice
> Saturday in April whether or not someone is tagging along with me. I
> often take friends and acquaintances with me and again, I don't expect
> or deamand any compensation from them. Is this any different?
>
> Thanks for your input!
>

Just go do it and don't run around telling everyone about it.

Bad idea, you can lose your certificate, void your
insurance, be sued and lose your home.


--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"Henry" > wrote in message
...
|> Here's a question for all the FAR/AIM experts:
| >
| > Each year our childrens' school has a charity auction to
raise money
| > for various events, services, and equipment. My wife
had the idea that
| > I could donate a one hour flight, which could be
auctioned for the
| > benefit of the school.
| >
| > I'm thinking that I'm OK here, but wonder what the
collective wisdom
| > may have to say. My rationale is this: I will receive
in no way,
| > shape, or form any compensation for my flying, from
anyone.
| > Essentially, I'm donating my expenses (rental, etc.) to
the school and
| > I expect nothing in return. In reality, I'd go flying
anyway on a nice
| > Saturday in April whether or not someone is tagging
along with me. I
| > often take friends and acquaintances with me and again,
I don't expect
| > or deamand any compensation from them. Is this any
different?
| >
| > Thanks for your input!
| >
|
| Just go do it and don't run around telling everyone about
it.
|
|

Thanks for the input, everyone.

I've got a mail into the FSDO to see what they recommend.

I won't risk my ticket by doing the anti-authority thing -- I still
remember that! While I don't always agree with the rules, I try to
play by 'em!

In the worst case, I could buy a certificate for an Intro Flight and
just donate that to the school, then I'm not involved (but I will
*definately* deduct that expense!). I hate to drop $80 and not log any
time, but it's not about me, is it? I'll try and sweet-talk the FBO
into donating or dropping the price an Intro Flight and maybe that'll
suffice.

Thanks again for your thoughts!

CAE

Tell them you want to pursue this under 61.113(d). Sometimes these FSDO
guys know less about actual FARS than student pilots.

Jim Macklin wrote:

> Bad idea, you can lose your certificate, void your
> insurance, be sued and lose your home.

Sure, but - other than that - what's the problem?

<Laugh>

- Andrew

CAE wrote:

> I hate to drop $80 and not log any
> time, but it's not about me, is it?

It's not just about you. There's a big difference, in my opinion, between
taking an intro flight with an instructor and taking a flight with some
school parent. The latter carries far more of the "anyone can be a pilot"
message, even to those that don't win the flight.

If the FSDO balks, of course, don't do it. But if you can, I hope you do.
And let us know what the FSDO says. If they approve, I'll probably steal
your idea myself for my kid's school.

- Andrew

P.S. Which FSDO?

> If they approve, I'll probably steal your idea myself for my kid's school.

I've done it. Sacramento FSDO. I never asked the FSDO, I told them per
FAR 61.113(d). The FARs say you have to notify them, not get their
permission. Friendly relations may dictate otherwise though.

I've done it too... I'm also pleading ignorance! (not that it would
do me any good) ;-)

My daughter goes to a Catholic School, which has had silent auctions to
raise money for the school. I offered short sight-seeing flights
because it was a talent I "could" offer. I hadn't even thought about
the compensation aspect, because to me, it seemed like a simple
donation from a third party to the school. I was merely in the loop as
an incentive for somebody to donate, even though I donated time and
expenses to the event.

I will definitely try to follow the appropriate protocols in the
future...

Todd